I'm afraid for HS^2

[tajazzled]

its just the official fanfic, no need to be afraid my friends. you can always rewrite it on mspfa, the good old homestuck tradition.

[Alder]

Yeah, adding onto that the crew seems to be made up of unstable people. Looking at their twitters it's kind of hilariously bad how unprofessional they are

What the hell is that supposed to mean?

It means exactly what it means. Kate, for one thing, kept publicly arguing with people on Twitter because they didn't agree with her stance on Vriska's character. She legitimately relates to Vriska so much that she doesn't see anything she did after she left Alternia as remotely condemnable. When you project your personality onto a character to that extent, that, to me, is unstable.

Saying the whole team was a gross generalization. The only issue I have is that they're willingly associating with someone like that on their team, which makes me wary of the project's quality.

Edit: Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but is she actually referring to Vriska here? Or is this person just passing around out of context? This would just make me worry for the writing quality in general.

Mod Edit: This is your second warning. Stop calling people you don't like unstable. Next one is a swing of the banhammer.

[sacreligiousDelphi]

Interesting depictions of WP staff aside, I don't even know what you're saying. You're starting from a conclusion, and when I ask you to show your work, you bring up tweets from one person on what I believe to be an 8-man team and Pesterquest routes that Kate didn't even write.

It's okay to not like somebody, but it kinda comes off as... you wanting to not like somebody and working backwards.

[calamityCons]

its just the official fanfic, no need to be afraid my friends. you can always rewrite it on mspfa, the good old homestuck tradition.

That doesn't make any sense. If it was truly fanfic, then it wouldn’t be on an official site. And just because it’s made by a creative team other than Hussie doesnt mean it’s fanfiction, because if that were the case then The Force Awakens is fanfiction. Extremely high production value fanfiction, but still fanfiction. Which is clearly is not.

I don’t know how to convey my inability to disregard homestuck2 and be worried/concerned/suspicious of its creative direction.

[aspiringWatcher]

its just the official fanfic, no need to be afraid my friends. you can always rewrite it on mspfa, the good old homestuck tradition.

That doesn't make any sense. If it was truly fanfic, then it wouldn’t be on an official site. And just because it’s made by a creative team other than Hussie doesnt mean it’s fanfiction, because if that were the case then The Force Awakens is fanfiction. Extremely high production value fanfiction, but still fanfiction. Which is clearly is not.

I don’t know how to convey my inability to disregard homestuck2 and be worried/concerned/suspicious of its creative direction.

Is Homestuck^2 canon to Homestuck? Is Pesterquest? Is Friendsim canon to Hiveswap? What about Pesterquest and Friendsim's co-canonicity?

What about Paradox fucking Space, the best idea Huss had since forever?

What is canon really though?

[calamityCons]

I suppose that is the crux of the problem then. I don’t really care about the metanarrative debate over what is or is not canon. What I want is a coherent narrative with characters that aren’t full of themselves and with epic superpowers doing cool fantasy things and maybe giving some actual closure to the characters I love.

The meta canonicity nonsense is fun and all but that’s not at all what I’m here for. from my perspective, it seems to be used as a smokescreen or deflection against actually discussing the events in the fucking story.

[sacreligiousDelphi]

Coherency and Homestuck aren't really two things that mix together all that well.

[calamityCons]

It certainly made more sense and had a followable plotline before act 6. At least to me.

[Alder]

Interesting depictions of WP staff aside, I don't even know what you're saying. You're starting from a conclusion, and when I ask you to show your work, you bring up tweets from one person on what I believe to be an 8-man team and Pesterquest routes that Kate didn't even write.

It's okay to not like somebody, but it kinda comes off as... you wanting to not like somebody and working backwards.

I never said Kate wrote that. That was me saying I was worried about the quality this new team could put out because it's a strange line for Terezi to have in light of the actions Vriska did. And I pulled back on that other comment and explicitly said any issues I had were mainly with Kate, namely on the account that I never realized all the times I had an issue with professionalism were typically with her.

[TC]

When are the updates anyways. I know it's monthly but like when.

[Alder]

When are the updates anyways. I know it's monthly but like when.

They said they're not going to keep a consistent update schedule outside of just posting once a month. Something about them not wanting to be harassed about them?

Also, CPA, am on mobile so I can't quote your post here but I think OP meant the gender changes were forced in the sense that characters like Roxy were suddenly given dysphoria when that was not previously noted in canon, making it feel forced rather than a natural progression of their personalities.

[Daz]

its just the official fanfic, no need to be afraid my friends. you can always rewrite it on mspfa, the good old homestuck tradition.

That doesn't make any sense. If it was truly fanfic, then it wouldn’t be on an official site. And just because it’s made by a creative team other than Hussie doesnt mean it’s fanfiction, because if that were the case then The Force Awakens is fanfiction. Extremely high production value fanfiction, but still fanfiction. Which is clearly is not.

I don’t know how to convey my inability to disregard homestuck2 and be worried/concerned/suspicious of its creative direction.

Is Homestuck^2 canon to Homestuck? Is Pesterquest? Is Friendsim canon to Hiveswap? What about Pesterquest and Friendsim's co-canonicity?

What about Paradox fucking Space, the best idea Huss had since forever?

What is canon really though?

I have a feeling that the WP team really tries to downplay the importance of HS^2, that they're just one of the many fans and what they write is not that important overall, as everyone is still free to make their own interpretation and do their own work regarding the material.

However, they're wrong. The moment the spotlight is on you, it's not just a fanventure you post to show your friends. It's not just a fanfic you post on O3 for a few hundred reads. A lot more people will be watching, and following what will happen, because you're handling something that amassed a large following over a long period of time. It has a lot more weight, like it or not. And if you want to handwave it away that "oh it's not canon, why do you care" then what's the point of making it official?

Handing over an existing material has always been a delicate matter - just look back to any recent example when an IP changed hands. If it's not handled carefully, if you don't build up trust from the audience (or at least show the effort - we all know you can't please everyone), it's going to end in disaster. And to be frank, considering what I've seen so far in general does not fill me with optimism, and I don't think I'm alone with that feeling.

[Darth_Energon]

Coherency and Homestuck aren't really two things that mix together all that well.

I'm going to have to disagree, at least earlier on a decent amount of things in Homestuck connected well in a very satisfying way.

[tajazzled]

lets make our own version?

[Sahxyel]

That doesn't make any sense. If it was truly fanfic, then it wouldn’t be on an official site. And just because it’s made by a creative team other than Hussie doesnt mean it’s fanfiction, because if that were the case then The Force Awakens is fanfiction. Extremely high production value fanfiction, but still fanfiction. Which is clearly is not.

I don’t know how to convey my inability to disregard homestuck2 and be worried/concerned/suspicious of its creative direction.

Is Homestuck^2 canon to Homestuck? Is Pesterquest? Is Friendsim canon to Hiveswap? What about Pesterquest and Friendsim's co-canonicity?

What about Paradox fucking Space, the best idea Huss had since forever?

What is canon really though?

I have a feeling that the WP team really tries to downplay the importance of HS^2, that they're just one of the many fans and what they write is not that important overall, as everyone is still free to make their own interpretation and do their own work regarding the material.

However, they're wrong. The moment the spotlight is on you, it's not just a fanventure you post to show your friends. It's not just a fanfic you post on O3 for a few hundred reads. A lot more people will be watching, and following what will happen, because you're handling something that amassed a large following over a long period of time. It has a lot more weight, like it or not. And if you want to handwave it away that "oh it's not canon, why do you care" then what's the point of making it official?

Handing over an existing material has always been a delicate matter - just look back to any recent example when an IP changed hands. If it's not handled carefully, if you don't build up trust from the audience (or at least show the effort - we all know you can't please everyone), it's going to end in disaster. And to be frank, considering what I've seen so far in general does not fill me with optimism, and I don't think I'm alone with that feeling.

I feel like one of the mega mistakes of Homestuck moving forward was Hussie giving us the blessing of Paradox Space and it carrying through the idea of 'everything is canon' to some degree and then just reneging on that. With the vastness of void that it occupies any AND everything can exist in the universe of Homestuck. Each session is like some tiny bubble in a cosmic sea which only Horrorterrors occupy. Everything can exist, everything can be as canon as your little heart wants it to be! That is until the Epilogues came along and make the HORRIBLE delineation that, no, there is totally absolutely a Real Canon™ which Meat exists and everything else is Noncanon™ and exists within the trash can known as AltCalliope's Candied black hole.

But being Noncanon is okay so if you like it just be content with it lmao

btw here's Homestuck^2 and more of that licensed Official Homestuck™ goodness you junkies want please gib money

[rookie1978]

When are the updates anyways. I know it's monthly but like when.

Also, CPA, am on mobile so I can't quote your post here but I think OP meant the gender changes were forced in the sense that characters like Roxy were suddenly given dysphoria when that was not previously noted in canon, making it feel forced rather than a natural progression of their personalities.

This. I don't care if characters are trans, gay, anything really, as long as it fits their character and serves a purpose and isn't flanderized as just being a personality trait (which I personally think is harmful to culture as a whole and enforces stereotypes.) It's also why I dislike the toblerone wishes making previously established characters trans with no reason or explanation, but that's canon now, because funny candy wish thing.

Dirk didn't just wake up one day and was suddenly gay, he didn't 'switch' to suddenly being gay later after his first appearance, that was always a part of his character and it came up multiple times in appropriate situations while not being forced or thrown in for little no reason. It even directly affected his relationships with existing characters (Roxy's one sided crush, his relationship with Jake, etc.)

Playing off these kinds of things as 'just happening' or 'why not lol' is lazy and hurtful, even if it isn't meant to be.

[deadlyAdder]

When are the updates anyways. I know it's monthly but like when.

They said they're not going to keep a consistent update schedule outside of just posting once a month. Something about them not wanting to be harassed about them?

Also, CPA, am on mobile so I can't quote your post here but I think OP meant the gender changes were forced in the sense that characters like Roxy were suddenly given dysphoria when that was not previously noted in canon, making it feel forced rather than a natural progression of their personalities.

Roxy doesn't have dysphoria lmao. Imagine thinking you need dysphoria about yourself to be trans. They're just trying to find what feels right for themselves. Characters change, whether onscreen or otherwise. You just sound like a tumblr baby.

"Wah wah chawactew change in way i dont like or undewstand!! wah wah wah!! time to thwow a fit!!"

[Alder]

When are the updates anyways. I know it's monthly but like when.

They said they're not going to keep a consistent update schedule outside of just posting once a month. Something about them not wanting to be harassed about them?

Also, CPA, am on mobile so I can't quote your post here but I think OP meant the gender changes were forced in the sense that characters like Roxy were suddenly given dysphoria when that was not previously noted in canon, making it feel forced rather than a natural progression of their personalities.

Roxy doesn't have dysphoria lmao. Imagine thinking you need dysphoria about yourself to be trans. They're just trying to find what feels right for themselves. Characters change, whether onscreen or otherwise. You just sound like a tumblr baby.

"Wah wah chawactew change in way i dont like or undewstand!! wah wah wah!! time to thwow a fit!!"

Very mature discourse.

[rookie1978]

That doesn't make any sense. If it was truly fanfic, then it wouldn’t be on an official site. And just because it’s made by a creative team other than Hussie doesnt mean it’s fanfiction, because if that were the case then The Force Awakens is fanfiction. Extremely high production value fanfiction, but still fanfiction. Which is clearly is not.

I don’t know how to convey my inability to disregard homestuck2 and be worried/concerned/suspicious of its creative direction.

Is Homestuck^2 canon to Homestuck? Is Pesterquest? Is Friendsim canon to Hiveswap? What about Pesterquest and Friendsim's co-canonicity?

What about Paradox fucking Space, the best idea Huss had since forever?

What is canon really though?

I have a feeling that the WP team really tries to downplay the importance of HS^2, that they're just one of the many fans and what they write is not that important overall, as everyone is still free to make their own interpretation and do their own work regarding the material.

However, they're wrong. The moment the spotlight is on you, it's not just a fanventure you post to show your friends. It's not just a fanfic you post on O3 for a few hundred reads. A lot more people will be watching, and following what will happen, because you're handling something that amassed a large following over a long period of time. It has a lot more weight, like it or not. And if you want to handwave it away that "oh it's not canon, why do you care" then what's the point of making it official?

Handing over an existing material has always been a delicate matter - just look back to any recent example when an IP changed hands. If it's not handled carefully, if you don't build up trust from the audience (or at least show the effort - we all know you can't please everyone), it's going to end in disaster. And to be frank, considering what I've seen so far in general does not fill me with optimism, and I don't think I'm alone with that feeling.

Daz summed up my feelings pretty well. It doesn't matter what the user personally believes in, as friendsim/pesterquest/HS^2 are all directly 'canon' and recongized by the comic's original creator. It's part of the IP now, and it's happening, and it's all considered official expansions.

That means you can't just put your hands over your eyes and pretend it isn't happening, because any time you want to discuss the comic, people are going to bring up things from these works. Imagine how silly you'd look saying "Well I don't think your right because I refuse to believe it happened and instead choose to subscribe to my imaginary fantasy world where everything worked out the way I wanted.'

Hussie's entire idea about what 'is' and 'isn't' canon is really neat, and well thought out, but in the end there's a VERY CLEAR dividing line. The context of 'narrative canonocity' matters more to Dirk and the actual universe they inhabit than the readers themselves. That was the entire point of the epilogues, in reality- Dirk establishes that without a villain there's no driving force, without a driving force the comic will end, the 'canon' ends, they basically cease to exist and their stories close, etc.

We don't personally decide 'what is canon' or ask what is or isn't. Canon is 100% 'Word of God', or in this case Hussie, who recognizes Homestuck, the two VNs, Homestuck 2, and Hiveswap as canon. Hussie's commentary in the books is canon.

Nicolas Cage playing his own game of Sburb and being classpected as the Nick of Time is canon, alongside Fedorafreak gaining the Gent of Piss title. Vriska having giant titties is canon after Hussie signed off on the picture of giant titty vriska and wrote 'canon' on it. I'm not kidding. That happened.

You could play it off by saying 'clearly they were jokes' or 'they weren't meant to be taken seriously' but the fact of the matter is nothing in Homestuck can really be taken seriously due to the silly nature of the comic, thus blurring the line further of what Hussie means to be canon and what he doesn't mean to be canon. (This also goes in turns with some fan's desperation for Act 6 to stop taking itself so seriously, which i'm pretty sure propped up around the time Dave and his bro's act 1 strifes were turned into an abusive relationship for an easy & lazy tearjerker moment, like John didn't bash his father with a hammer at the same time)

Either everything is canon or nothing is. The reader doesn't get to pick and choose. Headcanons/fanon are fine, but trying to establish your headcanon or fanon as canon is a very common fandom SIN. Which is, again, why having a bunch of random fans getting their hands on official canon writing a bad idea, and honestly, so was the toblerones. Which is, again, why I fear for Homestuck's official continuation (HS^2.)

[rookie1978]

Coherency and Homestuck aren't really two things that mix together all that well.

I'm going to have to disagree, at least earlier on a decent amount of things in Homestuck connected well in a very satisfying way.

Yeah, wasn't the entire point of the bunny, the loops in time, caliborn's great play, lord english being a combination of multiple trapped souls, and Caliborn-->Cal all supposed to 'blow our minds' with how everything was actually connected the whole time?